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Tommer
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Date Posted:11/11/2019 12:54:57Copy HTML

Hi All,


I am looking to build a complete collection of Arthur Fielder's Christmas output on CD and I have been having some issues tracking down all of the Pops Goes Christmas tracks. The 1987 Fielder and the Pops compilation "A Christmas Festival" seems to contain all of the tracks that are unique to Pops Goes Christmas but the Pops Christmas Party duplicate tracks are missing (at least the Pops Goes Christmas versions). does anyone know if there is a way to gather CD/digital copies of all of the Pops Goes Christmas Tracks?


I am also curious to know if, outside of their 3 Christmas albums, Fiedler and Pops recorded any other Christmas music...


Thanks and (an admittedly early) Happy Holidays!


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/12/2019 01:20:24Copy HTML


David,

If you're looking to include everything in your collection; then sure, coming to mind right off the top of my head is Fiedler's original 1949 mono recording of "Sleigh Ride," which was released as a single (on 45, as well as 78 rpm formats). When I get the chance, I'll check my journals for more and let you know. 


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Tommer Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #2
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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/14/2019 06:50:00Copy HTML

Thanks Chip,


Mono vs Stereo isn't necessarily to specific for me, assuming there is something unique about the mono version (The Beatles mono mixes can be meaningfully different from the stereo mixes, even though they are the same recordings, for eg.)


I'd also be interested in any artists/recordings that could be mistaken for Fiedler and the Pops, or at least nicely complement them. I have found that some of Ormandy's "The Glorious Sound of Christmas" mixes nicely with Fiedler, as an example. It has a very similar style about it.


Merry Christmas,

Tommer 

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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/15/2019 12:21:29Copy HTML


There's nothing unique about the mono version, other than it's Fiedler's original recording of "Sleigh Ride." But if you're going to add only one version to your playlist, then I'd strongly recommend the later stereo version.

As for other Christmas music that is similar to Fiedler's, there's Carmen Dragon and The Hollywood Bowl Symphony's 1957 album, The Music Of Christmas.



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Motown Mike Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #4
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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/15/2019 03:06:10Copy HTML

Morton Gould's A Musical Christmas Tree is another one with a Fiedler-like quality to my ears.

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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/15/2019 03:13:40Copy HTML


Yes, I agree. 


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/15/2019 09:58:45Copy HTML

Thanks Chip and Mike. I'll give both a listen and see if they work into the rotation. Much appreciated.

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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/16/2019 12:16:01Copy HTML



And David, the Hollywood Bowl Symphony Christmas LP is a fine album that I think will definitely work nicely into your rotation regardless The album resides in the 2nd Tier of my Top 500, coming in at #221. By the way, three of the songs from this album are part of the Yule Log's legendary soundtrack.


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rsteven Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #8
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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/16/2019 05:32:17Copy HTML


Hello Chip,


Oh man, the Hollywood Bowl Symphony Orchestra's Music Of Christmas is such a splendid instrumental holiday album. It is also quite pricey on the secondary markets. A like new version sells for around 80 bucks on eBay right now. Carman Dragon's arrangement of O Tannenbaum is stupendous, and I hope one day that Real Gone Music will get this gorgeous album remastered on CD some day. I am sure you might make that happen in a year or two.


I am currently in Mesa, Arizona for one daughter's graduation for a medical certification program and a birthday celebration for my other daughter. I also got to see my newest granddaughter for the first time in person, so my Real Gone Music Christmas slate is waiting for me when I get home. I already managed to get the Jim Reeves 12 songs of Christmas before I left, so that has been getting some heavy rotation with my kids already. My eldest daughter's favorite songs on the Reeves' album so far are Mary's Boy Child, Jingle Bells and Scarlet Ribbons, one of the two fantastic bonus songs on the album that you so wisely chose, Chip.


I cannot wait to get back home on Sunday and start playing the rest of the Real Gone Music lineup. Oh yeah, we found a great all Christmas radio station in Mesa, and the second holiday song I heard was Percy Faith's glorious version of Deck The Halls.  Wow, Percy Faith back on the holiday radio, I am a happy man!


Best regards,


Steve

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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/16/2019 09:38:48Copy HTML


Jim Reeves' magnificent rendition of "Mary's Boy Child" is one of two songs by him that I added to the Yule Log soundtrack in 2016 via the new 5th hour that I created and produced for the 50th Anniversary of the program.


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/23/2019 04:28:41Copy HTML

My favorite Fiedler/Boston Pops Christmas album is definitely "Pops Christmas Party", originally released in 1959 and recorded in stereo.  "A Christmas Festival" leads off both the CD and the LP.  A wonderful yuletide collection!


Thanks for the tip on "The Music of Christmas" by Carmen Dragon and The Hollywood Bowl Symphony Orchestra.  The entire album is on YT.  I'll be sure to check it out!  I know I won't be disappointed!

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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:11/23/2019 08:09:15Copy HTML


Just call it another "Chip's Tip."


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:12/01/2019 03:21:29Copy HTML

Hi Chip...after reading this topic I gave a listen to the original Sleigh Ride from Youtube from 1949 on the RCA label...can you tell me if that's the mono version as well? I noticed some variations of the original above compared to my Christmas Festival version on CD. Not sure if Stereo recordings were made in 1949...please clarify? Also, do you know if Christmas Festival version of Sleigh Ride is stereo or perhaps a re-recorded mono mix?

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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:12/01/2019 06:57:37Copy HTML


Rich,

There was only one version of "Sleigh Ride" by Arthur Fiedler in 1949: the mono version. Leroy Anderson, the composer, would record his own original mono version the next year, in 1950. Stereo technology was years off, and both Fiedler's and Anderson's stereo recordings of the song would not come until 1959.

And when you're asking about the A Christmas Festival version of "Sleigh Ride," if you are referring to Fielder's 1970 LP A Christmas Festival for Polydor Records; then yes, it is true stereo (the second stereo version that Fiedler recorded after the 1959 version; he would record it a third time in stereo (fourth overall, including the mono version) in 1972, for the LP, Pops Goes Christmas).


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:01/28/2024 02:04:19Copy HTML

Chip, what about the version on the 1962 Fiddle-Faddle and Other Leroy Anderson Favorites LP (LSC-2638)? Is that a different recording?

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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:01/28/2024 06:02:42Copy HTML


Don't have that particular album as I prefer the two Decca albums of Mr. Anderson recording his own music. But I would bet that RCA used Arthur Fiedler's 1959 stereo re-recording of "Sleigh Ride" for that 1962 Anderson tribute album.


   


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:02/04/2024 12:30:04Copy HTML

“Sleigh Ride” was indeed a new recording for that 1962 album. Chip. For one thing, it runs 2:48, or ten minutes shorter than the 1959 version. In fact, I can’t help wondering whether that 1962 version isn’t also the one on Pops Goes Christmas.


You can hear it here (beginning at the 6:12 mark):

https://youtu.be/Um8AaCNcJfw?feature=shared



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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:02/04/2024 04:00:01Copy HTML


No, I disagree on both counts. And I saw the discrepancy in the running time, but you can't always go by that because running times printed are sometimes notoriously inaccurate -- especially when it's within a few seconds like in this case. Just look at the discrepancy between the running times for several songs on the *same* album (1959's Pops Christmas Party and it's 1994 reissue) listed by Discogs here and here -- especially the "A Christmas Festival" and "Hansel & Gretel" selections.

There is just no way that RCA would have Arthur Fiedler record a second stereo version of the song when he had just re-recorded it three years earlier.

Don't say something is categorically true, when it's not.


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:02/04/2024 07:17:15Copy HTML

I'm prepared to admit I may me talking out of my head on this, but I don't believe I am, and here's another piece of evidence.


Robin Moore's 1968 biography Fiedler: The Colorful Mr. Pops— The Man and His Music includes, in a back-of-the-book appendix, a compete listing of Mr. Fiedler's recordings up to that time, including session dates, serial numbers, and catalog numbers for all tracks. Leroy Anderson's "Sleigh Ride" is listed as having been recorded on May 16, 1959 and again on June 7, 1962. (LM/LSC-2329 and LM/LSC-2638 are indeed the respective catalog numbers for the albums Pops Christmas Party (1959) and Fiddle-Faddle and Other Leroy Anderson Favorites (1962).


I've taken screenshots of the listings for the two session dates from the book, shown below.


Screen Shot 2024-02-04 at 2.03.20 PM.png



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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:02/04/2024 07:57:22Copy HTML


That might very well be what's in that book, but that *doesn't* mean that it's a different recording. All that means is that RCA Records assigned a *new* serial number and catalog number to the song for the 1962 LP.

Even Gordon (Anderson) didn't come across proof of a new '62 recording when he did the Boston Pops complete Christmas recordings anthology CD for Real Gone Music last year -- and he had direct access to the RCA archives. Sorry buddy, but this is the same recording that they just assigned a new serial number and catalog number to. But it doesn't change the fact that it's the *same* recording. It's just common sense too, because there would be no reason for RCA to have Fiedler to record a new version when he had just re-recorded it three years before.


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:02/06/2024 06:23:33Copy HTML

A couple more pieces of evidence, Chip, and then I'll go ahead and let the matter drop. (Promise!)


1.) First, here is a review of the Fiddle-Faddle album from the November 1962 issue of High Fidelity magazine. The reviewer, at least, certainly believes it consists of entirely new recordings of Anderson's compositions; note the comments about "the current multiple miking and 'spotlighting' techniques". 

6384282194679409149831543.png


You state that there would be no reason for RCA to have Fiedler re-record "Sleigh Ride" again after he'd done so just three years earlier. And, I would be inclined to agree with you... except that, if they had indeed had Fiedler record a brand-new album of Anderson compositions using their latest-and-greatest recording techniques (if, indeed, part of their impetus for commissioning said recording was to show off that "new sound"), then I don't believe it would be all that crazy for them to include one of the most popular and beloved of those compositions among that new batch of recordings. And if the sonics really were meant to be that noticeably different, then there might indeed have been a concern, well-founded or not, that the 1959 "Sleigh Ride" would stick out like the proverbial sore thumb. 



2.) The Fiddle Faddle album credits prducer Peter Dellheim and recording engineer Anthony Salvatore, while Pops Christmas Party credits "musical director" Richard Mohr and recording engineer Lewis Layton. Again, this strongly suggests (IMO, anyway) completely different recording sessions for all the tracks on the two albums.


 image.png

Screen Shot 2024-02-06 at 12.38.26 AM.png



3.) Finally, and granting that this is unavoidably a subjective impression, my ears tell me that these are definitely two different recordings. Not just a different tempo (which could be accounted for by a different copy being played at a different speed) but a different stereo spread, subtle differences in the mix, etc. To take one example, the clip-clops in the bridge – "giddy-up, giddy-up, giddy-up, let's go" – sound noticeably more prominent in the second clip (from Fiddle-Faddle) posted below. 


Could my ears be playing tricks on me? Of course. Maybe they aren't different recordings at all. But – to paraphrase Henry Fonda in one of my all-time favorite movies, 12 Angry Men – I'm saying a difference is possible.



"Sleigh Ride" (Pops Christmas Party, 1959)


"Sleigh Ride" (Fiddle-Faddle, 1962)



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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:02/06/2024 03:15:27Copy HTML


Well I could have saved you and I all this time if I had only looked at Gordon's new Boston Pops CD that I received last Christmas. I never played either one of his new Christmas CDs because my father passed away recently and just I wasn't into it. But in the CD he does *indeed* actually include a '62 version that he says was recorded in June 1962. Oy vey...

Anyway, his liner notes say it was actually recorded on June 2, 1962, not June 7 as that book you alluded to says. So who's actually right I can't tell you.


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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:02/07/2024 02:13:03Copy HTML

Well, that (mostly) clears that up. I guess now my question would be if the Pops Goes Christmas album uses that '62 version, or was that yet another brand-new one? (Which by my count would make it five different recoridngs of "Sleigh Ride" under Fiedler, counting the other RCA versions and the 1970 one for Polydor. Which, I know it's a Pops standard but... sheesh!)


Thanks for the info at any rate, Chip. And my condolences to you on the loss of your father.

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Re:Arthur Fiedler and The Boston Pops Chrismas Music

Date Posted:02/07/2024 03:27:53Copy HTML


I personally think if RCA reused a prior recording of "Sleigh Ride" for the 1972 album, it was the '59 version. Is there any way you can do an audio analysis? I don't have that kind of equipment to do it.

And thanks for the condolences, Mike. I appreciate it. 


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